This week's rotation.
Yu Yingzhao
Grace Magazine Automotive Division.
Managing director. A month ago, I went out for an event. Considering that it was not easy to park at the scene, I called a Didi special car, and after a while, the car came, a black Toyota.
Sitting in the car, I suddenly felt that the interior of the car was a little fresh. I casually asked the master, is your car an Asian dragon?He said that it was not the Asian dragon, it was the Toyota mirai. At the time, I was shocked and asked him if it was the legendary Toyota hydrogen fuel cell car, and he said yes.
Then I became interested, because except for a few new energy buses, I have the impression that this is the first time I have seen a live hydrogen fuel cell vehicle on the street, and it is actually a Didi special car!
I then asked the Didi driver, does this car have to be quite expensive?His answer was that it was almost 900,000 landed. Then I hurriedly looked at the Didi app, and once again confirmed that there was no hand slippage on the luxury car service, and then I asked the driver, your car is so expensive, do you rely on running a special car?The driver replied that it must be no fun, because this is a cooperation project between Didi and Toyota, and it can be regarded as a field test of hydrogen fuel cell models in China, and it has been running for a while.
My interest in this car has increased. I then asked the Didi driver who drove the mirai how the car felt and whether the work was good. He said that driving is similar to a fuel truck, but hydrogen refueling is a bit troublesome, because all hydrogen refueling stations in Beijing are outside the Fifth Ring Road, saying that it is because of safety considerations, but hydrogen refueling is a bit troublesome, and often have to go around to replenish hydrogen, and some more remote places do not dare to go, because they may not be able to find hydrogen refueling stations.
When I asked him how the cruising range of the car was, the answer was quite unexpected, and it mainly depends on where to refuel. Because the pressure of hydrogen refueling at different hydrogen refueling stations in Beijing is not the same. For example, the hydrogen refueling stations around the Fifth Ring Road can only add hydrogen with a pressure of 35 megapascals (MPa), and the general cruising range from this hydrogen refueling station is about 300 kilometers. Only one of the Yanshan petrochemical hydrogen refueling stations in Fangshan can fill 70 megapascals of hydrogen, and get out of there to run a car.
Five or six hundred kilometers is no problem, but I haven't been there a few times because it's too far away (I also checked later, China's domestic hydrogen refueling stations are indeed dominated by 35 megapascals, and foreign countries have now taken 70 megapascals as the mainstream). I also asked the Didi driver how long it takes to refuel each time, and he said that if there is no car in front, it is very fast, and it will be refueled within 3 minutes. If there is a big car in front of it, it will be out of order, and it is normal for this kind of car to add an hour and a half.
The Didi driver said that every time he drives, he has to pay attention to the remaining mileage at any time, and it generally shows that there are still kilometers left to run to the hydrogen refueling station, but it can't be like a fuel truck even if the fuel gauge is zero, because their captain specially instructed that the pressure is too low to refuel may damage the hydrogen cylinder in the car. This gas cylinder is precious, and it is said that if you change one, you will get 10,000, and there is a gas tank in the mirai car. So their standard operating procedure is to directly call a tow truck to tow the car to the hydrogen refueling station if the range is less than 60 kilometers. Also because of the special model, the hydrogen refueling station is dominated by a 35 megapascal "low-pressure" hydrogen refueling station, so the battery life is limited, so the car he drove can directly refuse to load without being sanctioned by the platform when he sees some remote work, which is a first-class benefit.
This trip from the North Fifth Ring Road to the East Third Ring Road is not too long, and the Didi trip makes me feel quite rewarding. It is easy for you to clarify the previous confusion, why the development momentum of hydrogen fuel cell civilian vehicles is so "constipated", to put it bluntly, in addition to the expensive car, and then hydrogen refueling is really troublesome.
A few years ago, there was a "hydrogen power dispute", which revolved around whether China's new energy industry should be dominated by electric vehicles, or whether electric vehicles and hydrogen fuel cell vehicles should be parallel. After chatting with this Didi driver, my gut feeling is that hydrogen fuel cells are really a lot of ......Very far. Taking Toyota Mirai as an example, the starting price in China starts at 750,000 yuan, and in the Japanese market it is about 35-400,000 yuan. If there is a domestic enterprise head iron into this track, the car can be "cabbage price" in an instant, I am convinced, but it is ...... to build its own hydrogen refueling station like a tram company building piles everywhere, no matter how you look at it, this thing is unreliable.
Or, hydrogen fuel cell vehicles can also have a "fast replaceable tank" technology like electric cars
Or, in the future, hydrogen fuel cell car companies will provide a "delivery of tanks to the door" or "tank separation" pricing
Forget it, let's look at the policy.
Miao Jun. Producer and editor-in-chief of MJ Car Talk.
Coincidentally, when I participated in the Toyota Technology Day in the second half of this year, I drove a Toyota mirai. To be honest, this car feels really good to drive. First of all, the acceleration is cool, which is much more direct than the throttle response of the oil car, but it is not as sharp as the first stage of the train, and the acceleration experience is almost between the oil car and the tram. The second is quiet, especially quieter and smoother than Shuangqing vehicles. Thirdly, the front and rear weights are well done, and the second-generation Mirai has been changed to rear-wheel drive, and the body has no noticeable pitching action whether it is braking or accelerating.
However, due to the existence of hydrogen storage tanks, the impact on its space is quite large. There will be a huge bulge in the rear row, and the trunk volume is not large, in fact, the width and height are okay, but the depth is too small.
On the day of the test drive, we also went to the hydrogen refueling station to experience the hydrogen refueling process, which is located near the Shanghai Automobile Museum in Jiading. There is no essential difference between the process of hydrogen refueling and refueling, and the maximum pressure is also 35 megapascalsMoreover, when the actual filling is carried out, the filling pressure value is actually constantly changing between 20-35 MPa, and only a short moment can reach the peak of 35 MPa.
We also asked Toyota's experts about the feasibility of the "quick can change" technology, and the answer was that this is indeed a direction that can be worked on. However, the same question, BMW experts were also asked at the event of test driving the BMW ix5 hydrogen fuel cell vehicle, and the answer was negative, mainly due to the consideration of interface safety.
Li Geng. Editor-in-Chief of Sedan Intelligence.
Car one plus one", "Let's go Uncle Farming",
Get in the car, foodie", founder.
In Toyota's eyes, it has always hoped to use hydrogen energy as the ultimate solution for power, hydrogen is cleaner, emissions are more environmentally friendly, and the energy replenishment process can be similar to refueling, which is time-saving and convenient. The driving experience is not much different from that of a train. The challenges to overcome are the volume and volume of on-board hydrogen tanks, the safety of hydrogen refueling stations, and the fear of carrying an explosive bag on the back of a vehicle similar to that of a natural gas vehicle, as well as the high price of the vehicle. At present, hydrogen fuel is beginning to be used in some commercial vehicles, and the relatively fixed route and working environment are also conducive to the construction of supporting facilities, and there is still a long way to go to achieve popularization in passenger cars.
Liu Hongcang. Author of Autohome.
I drove a Toyota mirai before, and the overall feeling is as described by Lao Miao, which is still good. There are many possibilities and voices for the future of hydrogen fuel. What I want to say is that any kind of new thing is always unreasonable in the early stage, and it seems that there is no way to justify it whether it is a closed business loop, a use environment or a consumer-friendly environment. This is mainly because there is definitely a conflict between the old and new models, and it is often problematic for us to measure the new model in the same way that we use the old model. In the early days of smartphones and electric vehicles, there was a similar phenomenon. The same is true for hydrogen fuel, if China's electricity price is very expensive, and the need for carbon neutrality is imminent, hydrogen fuel may be a natural choice - when the time comes, it is natural that someone will build a hydrogen refueling station, and someone will develop a tank replacement technology, which is not a problem. Of course, it may be possible that the business model of hydrogen fuel will not eventually form a closed loop and be eliminated in the competition with oil and electricity, but judging from the current development trend, I feel that the probability of hydrogen energy success will be greater.
Xia Dong. Kick the Car Gang" host and producer.
The biggest problem with fuel cell vehicles is hydrogen production, which requires electrolysis of water. While short-chain hydrocarbons such as methane and methanol can also be "fuel cells", pure hydrogen is the only way to achieve zero carbon. This substance must consume a lot of energy to extract and is difficult to store. At present, to really meet the general use of this kind of energy power in automobiles, you have to electrolyze water!Since electricity is inseparable, should it be used to electrolyze water, separate oxygen from hydrogen, and then distribute hydrogen to each individual car, and then combine it with oxygen to generate electricity, or directly store electricity in the battery to drive the car?What is the reason for such a lot of trouble?Can the electricity used for electrolysis of water and the electricity used by battery electric vehicles be environmentally friendly?I'm afraid not. It is not to deny the fuel cell as a technical solution, but to consider its effective application from a practical point of view. Wind or tidal power is used to electrolyze seawater directly near the sea to obtain hydrogen, which is exported to steel mills or other stationary energy-intensive industries by pipeline. Large-scale transport and mining machinery powered by fuel cells at relatively fixed locations or lines is a more realistic and valuable way to apply. The use of fuel cells, or hydrogen-powered internal combustion engines, in private cars requires the premise that humans already have surplus access to green electricity and can use it inefficiently.
Song Haitao. Investor of Haichuan Car and Roadside Parking.
I actually came into contact with hydrogen fuel vehicles ten years ago. At that time, it was BMW's hydrogen-fueled model, which seemed to be a V12 engine 7 series, with modified oil circuits and circuits to burn hydrogen without burning gasoline, 6The 0-liter 12-cylinder engine can only output more than 200 horsepower of the maximum horsepower, which is properly inefficient, although it is said to be environmentally friendly, but the energy consumption ratio is too low, so there is no car company to continue to dig deeper. In fact, the current hydrogen fuel cell vehicle is not quite the same as the hydrogen-burning engine back then, I also visited Hyundai Motor's hydrogen fuel cell power system factory in Guangzhou, to be honest, after reading it, I think this thing is only suitable for commercial vehicles, freight vehicles may be more suitable, rather than private users-based passenger cars, from the safety point of view, hydrogen fuel is not even as safe as electric vehicles, so, there is basically no suspense in the battle for electric hydrogen, at least in the field of passenger cars, hydrogen fuel is not competitive.