If the worker leaves the job, the training fee will be refunded first

Visual China.

Text |Fixed Focus, Author |Hanmo, Blues, Reminiscence, Xiang Yuan, Xingxing, edReminiscence.

Dong Mingzhu's remarks in an earlier interview have also been revealed, and she has proposed legislation to charge training fees for employees who change jobs. "Because you have worked with me for more than ten years, I have cultivated you, I have paid so much financial, manpower, material resources and time, and you slap your ass and leave, then your next unit will at least compensate me for my training fees."

This statement sparked heated discussions on the Internet. Weibo CEO Wang Gaofei commented, "I am not compliant in management, and if I suffer a loss, I will either scold employees or rely on the law."

As for the training fee mentioned by Dong Mingzhu, there is a lot of controversy in practice as to whether the employee should be compensated to the company when he leaves the company. Some people believe that this is a means for the company to deduct employees' wages;There are also people who believe that if an employee signs an agreement with the company about the training fee, then it must be done according to the agreement.

The reality is often more complex. Once the employee and the company are on the opposite side because of the issue of interests, it may become "reasonable and unclear".

Fixed focus I talked to five professionals, all of whom had conflicts with the company because of the training fee. Some people have to pay up to 30,000 yuan in training fees when they leave their jobs, which feels no different from paid part-time jobsSome people's induction training is military training + lectures without any dry goods, and they are also asked for training fees when they leave, and some people use their wages to deduct more than 10,000 yuan of training fees, and they also pay more than 1,000 yuan.

If a worker wants to leave his job, he or she will be refunded the training fee first. Here are their stories.

Yun Yun|30+ years old Hangzhou

After graduating, I was looking for a job, and after comparing several companies, I chose an Internet company with less negative news on the Internet, but I didn't expect to step on the pit.

Three months into the company, I was ready to leave my job. On the one hand, because the company asked me to do chores all day long, I thought I couldn't see the future, and on the other hand, the company would also use various ways to deduct employees' wages, the most outrageous of which wasEvery day, I want to write articles in the circle of friends, and I want to deduct money every day, and I will deduct 100 yuan if I miss a piece, which is called "happy donation", which is actually the "obedience test" given by the company to employees.

The process and formalities related to leaving the company were relatively smooth, but at the last step, my resignation certificate was withheld on the grounds that I did not refund the training fee to the company.

At the beginning, I didn't mention the training fee in the offer I received, and it wasn't until I signed the labor contract with the company that HR mentioned that there was a training fee. I think this clause is a bit problematic, it is a hidden mine, and I also consulted an HR friend, who said that the law actually does not support the charging of training fees for the training organized by the company itself, and the same batch of people who joined the company have signed this contract, so I signed it with the idea of "even if something happens, I am not alone". At the same time, I am a fresh graduate, and I have signed a three-party contract with the company, and if I lose the offer, I will lose money, and the company will also take advantage of the employees at this point.

After joining the company, the company has a week-long internal training, the main content is to hold a meeting in the company, the leader explains the company's culture and business introduction to the new employees PPT, and after the end, there is an uncomfortable icebreaker game. The training fee will be deducted from the salary every month, and a total of 30,000 yuan will be paid for three yearsIf the resignation is less than three years, the corresponding training fee must be paid according to the time of employment.

I was taken the opportunity by the company's HR to detain the resignation certificate, my first reaction was unhappy, the monthly salary in the past few months was less than 5,000 yuan, and I did not pay five insurances and one housing fund;Immediately afterwards, I regretted it very much, and felt that I should not have signed this contract, or even joined the company.

Originally, I wanted to apply for arbitration to get a resignation certificate, but the arbitration would take several months, and the company threatened to countersue me. At that time, I was not brave enough to graduate, and I quickly got an offer from a new company, so in the end, I was too lazy to spend any more time with this company and chose to give up arbitration. Former colleagues told me that many people didn't pay for the training when they left, and some people just took a long leave and never returned.

I think that the training fee is essentially "kidnapping" employees with unequal agreements, and in disguise, allowing employees to stay in the company for 1-3 years and not leave, belongs to "don't give the horse grass and the horse runs, resign and make the horse stumble", I didn't pay much salary, and I always want to take it out of the employee's bag, which is very ruining the reputation of the company.

After so many years, I gradually realized that the improvement of skills is all on my own, and I found that some leaders who really want to teach you things are silently dialing and sharing in their daily work, rather than engaging in formalism, letting everyone sit together to learn PPT, and then collect money from employees.

If the company wants employees, especially excellent employees, to take into account the overall situation and consider the development of the company before leaving, then it is necessary to use salary and growth space to retain people, otherwise, which company is not a talent?

Xiaoyu |24 years old Kunming

After graduating from university last year, I joined a property company as a management trainee. Before the official start of the job, they arranged a half-month training, before the training all new employees signed a training agreement, which mentioned that the training fee is 4,000 yuan, and the employee must work in the company for more than one and a half years, otherwise the resignation will pay the training fee.

At that time, they told us that if they didn't participate in this training, they would have no opportunities for promotion in the future. I didn't know much about it, so I signed the agreement. It was a fully enclosed training, and the company booked a round-trip ticket from Kunming to Hangzhou, and went to live in a prefabricated room in a park to provide meals in a unified manner.

In fact, this training has no value. The first three days of the first week were military training, just like military training in college, practicing queues, running, and gymnastics. In the next few days, we experienced some positions in the property, such as cleaners, we swept all day, and also experienced the work of security guards for a day.

The second week of the training is a class, and there are some lectures, some of which talk about corporate culture, and some of the leaders of enterprises come to give lectures, but there is no training in professional skills.

After taking up the post, my monthly salary is 4,600 yuan, and there is no fixed position for management trainees, and the work is changing every week. The place of work is also changing all the time, going to one place today, and probably going to another place far away without even a subway tomorrow. I didn't learn anything when I arrived at this company, almost all of them were doing chores, and sometimes the income in a day was not enough for me to eat and take a taxi.

I had been with this company for half a year before I quit at the end of the monthWhen it was time for the company to pay my salary, it directly deducted my salary of 4,000 yuan as compensation for training expenses, and the remaining salary was not enough to pay the social security of the month, and HR also asked me to pay 600 yuan.

Later, I called the Human Resources and Social Security Bureau to report this matter, and the other party contacted the company for mediation, and the company said that if the agreement was signed, the training fee would be compensated, and the Human Resources and Social Security Bureau told me that if there was any objection, it could only be arbitrated. I learned about it myself,The training agreement signed by the company with us was unreasonable, because the company did not provide professional and technical training, and there was no national certification certificateHowever, the company took advantage of a loophole and provided simple pre-job training as professional skills training, so that we could refund the training fee.

I later found out that some colleagues resigned after paying their salaries, and the company could only deduct half a month's salary, and the rest of the money was not recovered.

I worked very hard, especially in the last month, and I kept working overtime and running around, which means that I was paid to work. Such an enterprise treats employees unfairly and deprives others of the fruits of their labor at will, which is very pitiful.

In addition, I think the relevant departments should have more detailed management of the compensation for training fees, for example, simple induction training can not be included in the compensation, and training that provides qualification certification can be appropriately compensated.

Xiaowei |30+ years old Jiangsu

I used to work in a dealership store of a traditional car company, and my main task was to sell cars. The brand has a requirement for dealers, each store must be equipped with a corresponding proportion of licensed sales personnel, so we sales personnel need to participate in training and take the corresponding certificates when they enter the company.

Training is mandatory, attendance is mandatory, and an agreement is signed. This is similar to the overlord clause, where if you want to work for the company, you have to sign an agreement to train, or you will leave the job. The company doesn't care whether you go or not, but the brand has this requirement, so the personnel will arrange the registration. Endure or roll, is the slogan of the company's management.

As an employee, I definitely work in the unit, not to participate in training, as long as I do my job well. But training became a mandatory task.

The key is that there is a clause in the agreement that if you leave after training, you must pay all the training fees to the company. The money is deducted from the salary, and if it is not enough, it is paid out of pocket. If you go out for training, you will have course fees and travel expenses. The course fee is paid by the company, and the company pays part of the travel fee, but it is basically not enough, and the rest has to be paid by yourself. Therefore, if you leave after training, you will have to pay for it.

Later, when I left my job, more than 10,000 yuan of salary was all pasted in, and I also made up more than 1,000 yuan by myself.

The company thinks that it has cultivated you and given you the opportunity to go out for training to improve yourself, so you have to leave your job and compensate for the company's losses.

I didn't have anything to do with the company. Because on the one hand, I signed an agreement with the company before the training, and I didn't want to take care of it, and on the other hand, I had already found a new job at that time, and I needed to seamlessly connect to the next company, and I didn't want to completely fall out with the original company. In case the company cards my resignation certificate, social security, I can't do anything.

Moreover, the money and contracts are in the hands of the company, and it is a local enterprise, so you can't look up and see you unless you really plan to break up. Small places talk about human feelings, no more than big cities. In addition, it really makes trouble, which is time-consuming and labor-intensive. The company has the company's reason, you have your reason, and if you make trouble, no one knows what the result will be.

At that time, I passed the certificate test during the training. However, this certificate is limited to one brand, it is a certificate of the brand, not a national certificate, and it is not valid in other brands. When I leave the company, it automatically becomes invalid.

I think the training still has some personal improvements, such as process, skills, professionalism and other aspects to learn something more or less, but it still depends on the personal situation. At least for me, I can skip the training and do my job well, and the difference is not very big.

Nowadays, the management of many traditional enterprises is relatively rough, and you only need to obey if you feel the company. In a company with a lot of young people, it may be more humane. If a young person encounters such a situation, I don't have too good advice, it depends on the company.

Qian Nana|24 years old Hangzhou

Last year, after graduating from a media college, I started working as an anchor.

The first goal I set for myself was to find a reliable MCN institution first. Because I run a personal social platform account, positioned as a fashion blogger, before graduation, I began to spend more energy on updates. Soon after, I received a private message from an organization asking if I would consider being a fashion anchor.

At that time, I happened to be submitting my resume, and after reading the company information sent by the other party and the live broadcast room of its anchor, I felt that it was more reliable, so I made an appointment for an offline interview.

After several rounds of interviews, I was basically satisfied with the intensity of work and the promised income, but the other party proposed that I would not recruit pure whites. They don't mind that I have no experience, and I don't have a professional background, and I am a "wild anchor" when I go on the air, and I must learn anchor classes and improve sales skills before I can get on the job.

My supervisor gave me two options: I went to an outside organization for training, came back and passed the exam, or I could take a more structured course directly in the company. I chose the latter, because I did some homework and found that the classes of this company are more practical, and the courses outside are short and not cheap.

After the negotiation, the company asked me to sign a training agreement, which roughly means that the anchor training fee is 20,000 yuan, and the company and the employee each bear half, and if I work in the company for one year after training, I don't need to pay the training fee, otherwise I will have to pay half of the training fee. I calculated at the time that I would be able to earn back the training fee in a month, and it would not be a loss.

This was followed by a two-month training that allowed you to learn while working. Although I was able to learn a lot of things due to supervisor training, in less than two months, I often had a sore throat and stomach pain, and I also began to suffer from insomnia and my aunt's delay due to the intensity of my work.

I don't know how my peers are, but this company simply uses people as AI: the morning broadcast starts at less than 7 o'clock, the night broadcast gets 1 a.m., and the first broadcast is three hours, not only can we not eat and sleep normally, we don't even have holiday breaks, and we have to hold our urine often. I'm really afraid that I won't make any money, and I'll break my body first.

When I submitted my resignation, my supervisor asked me directly for money, and I asked rhetorically, do I still need money if I don't pay my salary?The other party took out the agreement, and then began to "personal attacks", which roughly means: Are you beautiful or talented, will ask such questions, if you are average in all aspects, why should the company train you for free?

I was so angry that I cried, and when I went home and told my parents, I was even more hit on the head. They said that they didn't agree with me doing this business, and they felt that they couldn't get on the table, and they were always afraid that some of the relatives in the family would brush meI still don't agree with me to make things bigger, after all, individuals can't fight the company.

At that time, I had a stomach ulcer and was physically exhausted, so I chose to compromise. The end result is,The training fee was deducted from my salary, which means that I sold goods to this company for free for two months.

Maybe this is a pseudo-MCN company that makes money from training fees, but I don't want to toss, just think of it as the first tuition fee I pay after entering the society.

Xiaoice|25 years old Guangzhou

I worked in a bubble tea shop for more than 2 months, but because the work intensity was too great and my body couldn't bear it, I asked to quit my job. This is a newly opened bubble tea shop, the pace of work is very fast, from morning to night, about 9 hours a day, there is no opportunity to breathe, and the management is not humane enough, once I did not prepare materials in time for lunch in the afternoon, I was said by the boss, but there was no order at that time.

After mentioning the resignation, the boss first proposed that I continue to work for a while and retract the idea of leaving, plus the staff of this store are relatively nervous and often too busy, but I refused. Later, when I was resolute, he said that my salary could be paid to me according to the number of days, but before half a year, a training fee would be deducted.

I was not happy to hear this, I was not happy with this job, and I had to deduct 1,000 yuan. And his so-called training fee, I don't think it's reasonable, first of all, I didn't mention this item at all during the interview, and secondly, the training process is not standardized enough, and I didn't learn much from it.

Although I talked about the system of the store and taught me how to make milk tea, I was relatively basic, for example, what is the approximate ratio of tea raw materials and water, how much creamer, cream, and milk are used, how to cook sago, etc., as for the details of many recipes, I was not taught.

In fact, I don't have much money in a month's salary, but I just can't get angry, I said that I want to apply for labor arbitration, and the boss said that the contract I signed has training content, which has legal effect, so arbitration is useless.

I have a friend who has had a similar experience of being deducted from training fees before, but the industry is different, and she told me that even if I signed a contract, I was able to do soIf only the internal staff are trained, and there are no expenses such as travel expenses in the process, and no economic losses are caused to the store, the boss has no right to deduct moneyI just have to keep my attitude tough.

I also consulted with a lawyer friend, and he told meEmployee skills training is within the scope of the legal obligation provided by the company, and it is generally not allowed to charge fees, even if there is a training fee in the labor contract, the company cannot deduct it at will.

Maybe because the store was busy, the boss didn't want to mess with me, and the amount of 1,000 yuan was not much, so he paid me the full amount of salary.

I don't think there is any threshold for working in a bubble tea shop, as long as you can endure hardships, but it is different from other types of catering in that it is busier. The time period for customers to eat is relatively concentrated at noon and evening, and when there are no customers in the afternoon, employees can rest for a while, but the milk tea shop is busy from morning to night, and the materials must be poured out and re-boiled when the time comes, and there are various utensils to be cleaned in the middle.

It is precisely because of this that this industry is very popular, and there are often employees who insist on quitting for two or three days, and many people are part-time, so the bubble tea shop is reluctant to let employees leaveSome stores will even ask employees to sign a letter of commitment, which states that if they have worked for less than half a year, the employee will automatically compensate the company for one month's salary.

At the request of the interviewees, Yun Yun, Xiaoyu, Xiaowei, Qian Nana, and Xiaoice are pseudonyms.